Sally Corp Interview

Sally Corp is well known and respected company inside the world of amusement parks, mainly for animatronics. Patrick Joossens, correspondent for Parksmania.it, had the honour to talk with three key persons inside of the company: Chairman and CEO John Wood, who is also one of the founders of the company, Design Director Drew Hunter (who was the lead designer on COT as well as many other rides) and Creative Director Jan Sherman, who has been at Sally now for 25 years.

Patrick: Do you remember your first working day at Sally Corp? How/why did you decide to start working for this company?
Drew: I arrived at Sally Corporation on my first day precisely at the stroke of 9 AM. I was impressed that all the employees were already thoroughly involved in their work. Usually, I thought, folks arrive, get a cup of coffee, visit a few minutes, then get down to work. But not at Sally! I went to see John Wood, and he asked me if I'd had any trouble finding the building on my first day. I said no, that I found it easily, and I was right on time. He replied that it was nine o'clock, and the Sally work day begins at eight! Well, that certainly explained why all the employees were already working away when I got there.
Jan: Before I joined the company as a full-time employee, I wrote and directed Sally’s very first musical animal band shows on a free-lance basis. So my first working meeting was with John Wood and the other founders of the company; we had a discussion about the characterizations and show content. I remember being very excited about the challenge, and also a little scared. I came on board full-time about six months later, charged with the responsibility for show production plus advertising and marketing materials design and production, and public relations.


Patrick: What did you do before starting at Sally Corp? Was it in a similar environment?
Drew: For a number of years I owned a company called VORTA, Inc., which specialized in Halloween and haunted entertainment design. We also did theme design work for non-haunted venues which included a lot of mural work. I also have an extensive background in theater, including scenic design, scenic painting, acting, writing, and directing. I have always been involved in team oriented creative processes.
Jan: My background was primarily in theater: I worked not only as an actress, but in just about all aspects of theater, both onstage and offstage, and in radio and television for many years. That included marketing and public relations, so the opportunity at Sally encompassed most of my skills and interests…an irresistible combination!

Patrick: Have you seen an evolution during the years you have been working for Sally Corp? Within the company, within the amusement park industry.
John: The Company has evolved considerably in its 30 year life. In 1977, we built the first five prototype animatronic figures in a garage utilizing DC motors and simple electronics. By 1980, we were creating musical stage shows requiring new techniques for animation (pneumatics) control systems (multi function computers), the development of show software and stage settings. It was a major shift from equipment production into entertainment.
Before the end of the decade, we set our sights on the creation of themed dark ride attractions similar to those developed by Disney and Universal. During those same
30 years, we’ve seen the movie theme parks and water park industries blossom worldwide and the development of such anchor attractions as rapids rides and simulator theatres take hold. Most significantly however; the amusement park industry evolved from being a family owned, entrepreneurial industry into a corporate and consolidated industry with professional management and techniques (which I am not sure has been a positive evolutionary process).
Drew: There seems to be a decided trend toward more participatory and immersive attractions. Sally Corporation has become a leader in this field, and we're always exploring new ways to bring interactivity to our dark rides.
Jan: The evolution over these years has been amazing. The company has gone from focusing on fairly simple animated figures for retail environments, in the beginning, to musical shows with cartoon animals and humans to very detailed, sophisticated and believable characters and, of course, to dark rides including major, world-class interactive dark rides. Naturally, as our product line has evolved, so has our staff. However, a core of long-term people remain, including John Wood, one of the company founders who is now our Chairman and CEO. I have now been at Sally for 25 years.

Patrick: Sally Corp has also great attractions in Europe. What are the greatest accomplishments within our continent?
Drew: Sally's Challenge of Tutankhamon interactive adventure dark ride is a fantastic attraction, and we remain very proud of it. This spring we will be installing another major ride-through attraction in Sweden. Though it is non-interactive, it will be like no other ride we've ever done. I call it a "memory ride".
John: Unquestionably, our greatest accomplishments have been the two major interactive dark rides we created for Terra Mitica in Spain and Walibi Wavre in Belgium. Each of these are anchor attractions for their parks and feature high quality animatronics, realistic scenery and very special special effects. Labyrinth of the Minotaur and Challenge of Tutankhamon feature timeless themes and mythological stories that have captivated the imagination of people of all ages. We believe there should be more of these rides built and enjoyed.

Patrick: Sally Corp is more than producing animatronics, you also design entire dark ride concepts. Is it possible/difficult to create new ideas or concepts for dark rides? What do you think about the next generation of dark rides where also live actors play a strong role? Are they a good chance to boost a Sally theming?
Drew: With an open mind, out-of-the-box thinking and a terrific creative team, we can come up with anything at Sally! Introducing live performers into a dark ride attraction has certainly been done with some success. However, what you don't get with a live performer, and what you do get with an animatronic figure, is consistency. Different live performers will give varying levels of effectiveness and skill. It is something that can bring an added excitement and dimension to a dark ride attraction, but it is definitely something which must be constantly supervised.

Patrick: What evolution do you see with dark ride vehicles.
JOHN: Conveyance systems for dark rides have always been relatively simple people movers. Boats were the first transportation vehicles in Old Mill and Tunnel of Love rides and boats remain popular today. Everyone seems to enjoy a good old fashioned float trip! The greatest evolution of dark ride conveyance has probably been the use of trackless vehicles that allow the game (in an interactive attraction) to affect the show. These automatic guided vehicles are used in both the Labyrinth and Tutankhamon rides with great results. In addition, we used a smaller four passenger AGV in the Scooby-Doo ride for Warner’s MovieWorld in Madrid.
Spiderman demonstrated how effective the use of simulation can be along with 3D film techniques in a themed story ride. We believe that elements of thrill also belong in a dark ride experience and we are working on ride systems that will be able to deliver unusual thrills to the theme park visitor.

Patrick: On your website, we see a reference to award winning work Sally has accomplished. Can you tell us more about it?
Jan: From our earliest years, we have had the good fortune to be recognized with awards from the industry and fan clubs. The most recent award was last year for Scooby-Doo Adventure at Warner Bros. Park in Madrid. It was named Best New Family Ride 2005 in Europe at the UETPA Awards. We have received awards for our rides, our technology, our trade show exhibits, our marketing videos, and our brochures. Challenge of Tutankhamen won every major award for dark rides and attractions the year it opened.

Patrick: You received several awards from amusement park clubs. Are these awards important for your company as an extra motivation?
Drew: Sally is in the entertainment business. If we do not entertain the guest–-first and foremost—we have failed. Having the various clubs and organizations honor us with accolades and awards for our attractions proves that we have succeeded in our goal of entertainment!
Jan: Receiving an award from the clubs or trade organizations is always very special to all of us at Sally: like being given an unexpected Christmas gift! Our people are very dedicated to what they do, really putting their heart and soul into every project; so when the project—whether it’s a ride or our trade show exhibit—is recognized with an award, everyone is delighted: we love to know our work is appreciated. We also proudly display the awards here at Sally.

Patrick: In Europe there are some parks with great dark rides, but in general it is quite poor. Do you have any idea why dark rides are not that popular. Might this be a great opportunity for Sally Corp to convince those parks of buying a dark ride concept?
John: Good dark rides are always popular and are anchor attractions at the best theme parks worldwide, but we live in an ‘experience’ society and the old, passive, visual dark rides cannot remain popular for decades on end. It is imperative that today’s dark rides involve as many of the senses as possible and provide entertaining experiences every time they are ridden. This is the reason why interactivity plays such a big role in the future of dark rides. The competition of a game that is both fun and exciting never grows tired! Many of the old dark rides have been around too long and need to be replaced with newer and fresher attractions. It is primarily due to their continued popularity that they have not been upgraded to today’s standards. Unquestionably, this presents a great opportunity for Sally as we have striven to revitalize rides and create new family attractions for the next generation to enjoy.

Patrick: Which are the latest projects, we should be expecting?
Drew: This spring watch for a really unique ride-through attraction in Vimmerby, Sweden: it is entitled "Vi Pa Saltkrakan". Located at Astrid Lindgren's World, it is a delightful, light-hearted showcase of many of the more beloved scenes featured in the 1960's television series of the same name which is adored by the Swedes. And next year, get ready for a most unusual dark ride experience from Sally Corporation in the new Hard Rock Park.
John: We are working on quite a few, but most of our best attractions are a collaborative effort with the parks they are designed for. Most certainly the future rides will contain more challenging game elements, more sophisticated technologies and more elaborate special effects.

Patrick: Why are there so few rollercoaster or waterride concepts, using animatronics? Is there any specific reason you have experienced when contacting parks? Or is it difficult to develop such a concept?
JOHN: It is rather difficult to appreciate animatronics when you are going 90 miles per hour! In addition, it is difficult to create successful, long lasting theatre elements in outdoor settings. However, we firmly believe that many ride experiences can be enhanced with animatronic show elements in the preride and queue areas. When we have had an opportunity to work on an enclosed thrill experience like Exterminator at Kennywood or Voyage to the Center of the Earth at Water World in Denver, the ride experience is greatly enhanced with animatronics, special effects and story telling.

Patrick: Is it difficult for parks to maintain dark rides? What are the tricky parts in a dark ride?
John: No is the simple answer. With proper care, cleaning and maintenance, a good dark ride attraction can last forever. The conveyance systems are relatively simple to maintain for today’s park maintenance teams and the animatronics, special effects and show elements are much easier than rollercoasters to look after. The trickiest part of keeping a dark ride fresh and vibrant is staying on top of the little things like smoke fluid, burned out lights and keeping things clean.

Patrick: How do you start a project, when you have to start from zero? Do you start with a storyline, with the track for the vehicles and build the story around it,...?
Drew: Sometimes a client will want a dark ride but will have absolutely no idea what it should be. And sometimes a client will have a basic theme in mind, but not know how to develop it. In either case, it is up to our creative team at Sally Corporation to deliver a concept which works for the client. Story always comes first. We then develop the scenes, the ride layout, the mode of transportation, the soundtrack and all the other important design aspects of the attraction.

Patrick: Besides your professional obligations, do you visit an amusement park for fun? What kind of rides do you prefer? Are there any rides, built by a park or another company, that you really admire?
Drew: Ever since my first visit to Disneyland in 1957, I have loved going to theme and amusement parks for my own pleasure. Much later in life, when I began working with parks professionally, I thoroughly enjoyed seeing how the parks operated on the inside and helping parks develop attractions.
I have been intrigued by dark rides ever since my first ride on Mr. Toad way back in '57. Then in 1958 my parents took me to the long-gone Pacific Ocean park in southern California, and I experienced the many innovative and fun dark rides there. It was then I knew that I wanted to grow up and create such attractions.
As far as roller coasters go, I admit that I have a love/hate affair with them. I ride them occasionally, but I am not a fanatic as some folks are. I do enjoy studying them and watching them, however. Architecturally, there are few things as beautiful to me as the deceptively graceful form and function of a big wooden coaster. My perfect idea of a coaster is a themed coaster like the superb new Expedition Everest at Disney's Animal Kingdom.
My favorite rides? Sally's "Tut" in Belgium is at the top of the list, of course. Our Jocco's Mardi Gras Madness in Six Flags New Orleans (formerly Jazzland) was a really fun and colorful ride (unfortunately the ride and the park were destroyed by hurricane Katrina). And of course I enjoy Spiderman at Islands of Adventure, Dinosaur at Disney's Animal Kingdom (and Indiana Jones at Disneyland), and all the other classic Disney dark rides.
Jan: I love going to the parks, not only for the rides, but for the entertainment, the ambience and the chance to see how other people react to the various attractions. Several of us had the good fortune to visit Tivoli Park both at Christmas and during the summer season: it’s an enchanted place, and like Liseberg and Alton Towers, way at the top of my favorites list.
Like Drew, I prefer to admire roller-coasters from afar! However, I’ve always thoroughly enjoyed dark rides, starting with the classics, Pirates of the Caribbean,
and Disney’s Haunted Mansion. I’ve always been fascinated by the Haunted Mansion’s special effects. I think COT is a terrific ride…it’s one ride that can be enjoyed whether you shoot at the targets or not, and I can’t wait to ride El Ultimo Minuto, our new ride at Dinopolis in Teruel, Spain. The animatronics we built for that ride are amazing…they include a twenty-five foot long crocodile among many other pre-historic animals and humans. El Ultimo Minuto (The Last Minute) is an educational ride, a really fun way to teach evolution.
John: Absolutely! My family wouldn’t have it any other way! The people who succeed in this business have a passion for it and even though I visit dozens of parks each year, I never grow tired of the experience! My favorite rides are the wooden rollercoasters and of course, the dark ride. Because we live just a few hours from Orlando, we usually visit one of the Disney or Universal parks. Their quality attractions are always entertaining and timeless in their appeal. They have the money to do it right and strive for perfection with every attraction.

(Patrick Joossens correspondent for Parksmania.it)